---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Seema Sapra <seema.sapra@googlemail.com>
Date: Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 11:21 AM
Subject: Re: General Electric whistleblower continues to be targeted- complaint of involvement by Kian Ganz, editor and publisher of Legally India legal news website
To: "KIAN GANZ (Legally India)" <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com>
Ha ha,
I just stated facts, Kian and your bullshit below only establishes your malafides.
I will respond to this as well in due course.
Seema Sapra
On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 11:19 AM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com> wrote:
Hi Seema,
Aw well, I guess I tried my best to help but you've pushed me away as you seem to have pushed away all others in your life who've ever tried to help.
Please feel free to post whatever you like on your blog, social media, etc, but I have honestly don't have the time anymore to engage.
There's a core of you who's a very intelligent and rational person, but this is unfortunately being buried right now under a layer of paranoia, which ends up suspecting everyone you meet of being involved in a conspiracy against you.
Can you name a single person you've met in the past years, casually or otherwise, that you don't eventually suspect of working against you?
I understand you've been wronged in the past and were not treated right at GE, but you also have to accept that you have to change your life right now.
You can not continue living in your car and without a home or a job.
Those things are unhealthy for any human being, and how can you ever hope to live a normal life, whistleblowing or no, if you don't sort out your basic human needs?
You need to take responsibility for your life instead of blaming others all the time.
The last piece of advice I can give you, again appealing to the rational part inside of you that existed before GE ever entered your life, is that I would urge you from the bottom of my heart to find an independent counsellor whom you can trust and who was not recommended to you to anyone else, perhaps in 'cognitive behaviour therapy (CBT)', or 'rational emotive behaviour therapy (REBT)'.
I don't know if there are any good practitioners in Delhi and I obviously don't want to recommend you any names since you'll undoubtedly suspect that I'm trying to brainwash you or something, but I'm sure if you set your mind to finding someone independent you can, since you are clearly very resourceful.
Anyway, I honestly wish you all the best in your life and hope you can find happiness one day despite the adversity you're facing and have faced in your life.
But I can't afford spending more of my time on helping you unfortunately for now, so I've taken the liberty of blocking future emails from you and muting you on Twitter.
If there's ever anything you want to share which is not an accusation, you can send me an SMS and I'll re-enable emails from you temporarily.
Warm regards,
Kian
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 03/08/2015 10:52, Seema Sapra wrote:
Kian Ganz,
Now lets get the facts right. We met after I contacted you to explore the possibility of writing for Legally India. I was not exactly asking you for a job then and our meeting was exploratory. I think we both wanted to meet and see if there was a possibility of some cooperation.
During our meeting, you encouraged me to talk about what happened at General Electric and what my whistleblower complaints were about. When I mentioned I had been poisoned and drugged, your strange response was that I should not talk about that because journalists would be more willing to do a story on the GE complaints if I omitted this part.
When I started talking about the medical evidence on the record to show that I had been physically harmed, you suddenly told me you had no time and were in a rush.
We discussed the possibility of my writing on a regular freelance basis for LI. You were interested in my doing this and I also at that point indicated my interest and we decided that we would take this forward.
However, later in the conversation, you made some very strange statements. You told me that I should stop making email complaints to the authorities about being poisoned because that would make people at GE angry and they would poison me more. You told me that instead I should email you first if anything happened or if I was poisoned.
You told me that I should do nothing for about 8-10 months and that if things did not improve, you would help me with my complaints against GE.
You repeated this when we were saying goodbye and I said so you are saying I should trust you.
I point out that we hardly knew each other and this was the first time we had met.
During our conversation, you also attempted to try and get me to believe that any symptoms that I was experiencing were the result of organ damage from past poisoning. At one point you made the absurd suggestion that maybe I had been exposed to asbestos. Now unless I have been poisoned by also being exposed to asbestos deliberately because of my whistleblower complaints, let me assure you that I have no past history of asbestos exposure.
During this meeting when I said that AZB, Zia Mody's firm had committed a fraud on the Delhi High Court, your response was that AZB commits frauds everyday, and that the law was an ass.
After our meeting, when I reflected on it, it became clear to me that you had said things to me based upon instructions from someone connected to those targeting me.
I therefore decided that I would not follow through on writing for LI. And I not take the matter forward at my end.
You allowed several comments on LI targeting me personally. You took them down after I objected or attempted to respond. When I asked that my response be put up, you used the excuse of trolls to ask me to ignore the issue. I did on some occasions.
In this light, I am 100% certain that your twitter messages to me were deliberately intended to cover up the attempt to create a false medical record in my name at Quest Diagnostics. Do you think I did not know what phishing is before you 'enlightened' me.
I also note that the poisoning that I was subjected to substantially intensified after my meeting with you. I believe that you carried our conversation back to GE"s lawyers, probably at AZB.
You willingly became a part of the conspiracy to eliminate me.
You very subtly allowed me to be targeted on Legally India.
I intend to put our entire correspondence in the public domain.
You have violated your journalistic ethics.
I intend to follow up on this by making complaints against you to the authorities. There is evidence to substantiate all that I have stated above.
And stop patronizing me, it just exposes your attempt to cover up your malafides.
Seema Sapra
On Sun, Aug 2, 2015 at 2:53 PM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com> wrote:
Seema. Sigh.
You asked to meet me for a job, I spent hours with you listening to your story and hearing about your troubles and was sympathetic.
Now what's the point of what you are doing exactly? What are you hoping to achieve? Is there any rational reason for this? What have I ever done to you?
Do you have any factual objection to the DMs? Did you bother following those links or doing some research on Google about spam? If you did, you'd find that everything I sent you is 100% accurate.
I have no beef with you but please Seema, stop trolling me, it is unprofessional.
Best regards,
Kian
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 02/08/2015 14:26, Seema Sapra wrote:
Kian,
I reproduce below a twitter DM conversation we had on 15 July 2015 minutes after I posted the following post on my blog http://seemasapra.blogspot.in/2015/07/fwd-general-electric-whistleblower_0.html
Someone had tried to create a false medical record in my name at Quest Diagnostics. I had posted a screenshot of an email sent to me with an attachment which I did not open.
You took an extraordinary, inordinate and unsolicited interest in trying to persuade me that this was mere spam and not part of a conspiracy to harm me. You also attempted to persuade me to remove this blog post. Why? The fact that I received this email from a Quest Diagnostics account is clear and we both don't now what the attachment contained as I did not open it. So why were you trying to project this as mere spam when you could not know this?
You messaged me on twitter within minutes of my posting this blog. And then you repeatedly messaged me on this. Why?
The twitter DMs are reproduced below, as is my email to the authorities on 15 June which I had posted on my blog which you read. .
Seema Sapra
Twitter DMs between Kian Ganz and Seema Sapra on 15 July 2015
“Seema - just read your blog. Those emails just look like spam to me and / or viruses that get sent out indiscriminately...
Legally India
Don't open the attachments and just file them as junk mail...Same goes for porn Twitter handles - that kind of spamming happens to everyone
Jul 15
Seema Sapra
What about the quest diagnostics email - thats from their email address
Jul 15
Legally India
Same goes for calls - the first number is a marketing call from Vodafone. Check http://truecaller.com http://www.truecaller.com/in/1207166000
Jul 15
The 2nd number is some bus company or some random crap... Truecaller is semi-accurate on this stuff sometimes
Legally India
Quest Diagnostics is definitely spam laced with a virus... MHT files can contain viruses. I get dozens of similar emails per day.
Jul 15
It's known as phishing. Some hacker hacks random email accounts and uses those to hack other email accounts, which are then used for same
hope you didn't open the attachment - it could have contained a virus that could in theory compromise your computer https://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=1600.0 …
Legally India
I get literally dozens of these every day... Normally gmail spam filters are supposed to catch them but sometimes they can come through
Jul 15
Legally India
You're getting these because your email ID is on your blog. Bots crawl the net looking for email to send their spam to, and pick it up there
Jul 15
Legally India
if you did open the attachment let me know, we can run some hard core virus checks on your comp
Jul 15
Seema Sapra
No, I don't touch such attachments, My PC is safe, But I do think GE agents or whoever is targeting me are behind some of this.
Jul 15
Legally India
I can guarantee you 1000% that this has nothing to do with GE... It's just standard spam - I can literally show you 100s like it
Jul 15
Legally India
Here's some background that may be interesting:http://www.tamingthebeast.net/articles4/virus-spam.htm …
Jul 15
I just resent and reposted the message because I did not want the word "porn" to appear on my blog.
Seema Sapra
Who knows what the quest diagnostic email attachment contains, it cld be false med record attempt , anyway thanks
Jul 15
Trust me, it's definitely a virus - no one would send a medical record, false or otherwise, as an MHT file...
If I were you I'd unpublish the blog post, it doesn't advance your cause in any way, in my opinion, though it's your choice of course...
Legally India
If hypothetically it was by GE, you're showing them you got flustered by posting it.
Jul 15
Legally India
If it's not GE, you're showing them that you got flustered even when it wasn't them. Neither outcome very useful to you...
Jul 15
Legally India
talking of spam, i just received this, which is definitely a virus since it's got a .zip attachment http://snag.gy/KlKYE.jpg
Jul 15
Legally India
And here's another virus-spam laden email: http://snag.gy/6mVU6.jpg
Jul 15
Seema Sapra
Hey stop sending me all these viruses :)
Jul 15
Legally India
Delete this direct message
Haha - they're just screenshots :) Harmless to click on, I promise :)
Jul 15
Direct message text”
On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 8:33 PM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com> wrote:
Seema,
I'm sorry, but I consider your publication of our email correspondence on your blog and the allegations you made against me deeply saddening and a violation of the trust that I, as a journalist, had placed in you.
In light of this, I don't think I can justify engaging in any further correspondence with you I'm afraid.
Best regards,
Kian
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 01/08/2015 20:26, Seema Sapra wrote:
Kian,
Please provide me with all comments (including those that you censored) that you have received at Legally India targeting me in whatsoever manner, defaming and maligning me, or attempting to publicly humiliate me. I view such acts as serious attempts to target me as a whistle-blower who has made corruption complaints against General Electric Company which issue is not closed.
Please also provide me with the IP addresses for such offensive comments and contact details of the persons who targeted me in this way.
I intend to make police complaints and complaints to other authorities regarding such targeting.
Please provide this information and material within one week.
I also request that you post this entire correspondence on Legally India.
Seema Sapra
On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 3:47 PM, Seema Sapra <seema.sapra@googlemail.com> wrote:
Kian,
In response, the way I see this whole matter.
I am a lawyer who worked with General Electric and was compelled to make very serious whistle-blower complaints. Attempts were made on my life and I was targeted with the help of the police, lawyers and doctors who covered up complaints of poisoning. This led me to file a writ petition in the Delhi High Court in which notice was issued by the Court to General Electric Company, GE India Industrial Private Limited, GE Global Sourcing Private Limited, Siemens, Alstom, Bombardier, EMD (a Caterpillar subsidiary), BHEL, the PMO, the CBI, the Delhi Police Commissioner, the CVC, the Railway Ministry, and to GE officers Jeffrey Immelt, Brackett Denniston, Alexander Dimitrief and John Flannery. This matter was before the Delhi High Court from February 2012 until March 2015.
Despite several protection orders passed in this matter, during the pendency of this matter, I was deliberately rendered homeless, was repeatedly drugged, was repeatedly poisoned including by deliberate exposure to poisonous chemical fumes and gases, was rendered disabled by the deliberate destruction of my left ankle, was defamed, faced attempted psychiatric retaliation and repeated attempts to label me mentally ill including in an anonymous blog posted online, faced attempted abduction, faced destruction of my property, faced destruction of evidence in this matter, faced repeated attempts to create circumstances so that I could be unlawfully confined and placed under a third party’s control, faced retaliation at the hands of lawyers connected to the parties and individuals incriminated in my whistle-blower complaints.
Finally, in a completely unlawful decision, two judges of the Delhi High Court refused to look at the court record and to decide my petition and applications for relief by terming them infructuous because during the pendency of the matter, the corruption tainted tenders were cancelled by the Government in an attempt to cover up my corruption complaints and to protect General Electric and powerful Indian public servants involved like Montek Singh Ahluwalia.
Fortunately in my case, the complete court record is available online on my blog, as are audio recordings of several court hearings and this material is sufficient for anyone who takes a look to appreciate the cover up that is being attempted of my corruption complaints and the manner in which I am being targeted.
There is medical evidence on record which establishes poisoning, there is evidence against police of targeting me, there is evidence that AZB appeared in this matter for GE without valid legal authority and that authority documents and affidavits filed allegedly on behalf of GE are false, fraudulent and perjurious. There is sufficient evidence of corruption and other unlawful practices against GE on the court record in connection with my corruption complaints. I could go on, but there is actual documentary evidence on the court record or in police complaints to establish each and every complaint made by me including of me being targeted.
And the targeting including poisoning has continued since March 2015.
So coming to Legally India, I agree that you have not personally harmed me or targeted me. I appreciate the positive interactions I have had with you, in a personal meeting, in emails and online, whether on LI or on twitter.
But as you are very well aware, I have been viciously targeted in comments against me on LI, the worst of which you have censored. And I appreciate that.
I also appreciate our understanding that I do not use LI to agitate my whistle-blower complaints against GE. And I have not done that ever. In fact when we met, I made clear that I was not asking you to do a story on my whistleblower complaints against GE.
But those targeting me not only for my whistleblower complaints against GE, but for complaints by me against some judges, some lawyers and other individuals which are all an off-shoot of my being targeted because of GE, do not want me to lead a normal life. The campaign against me is especially targeted at spreading disinformation against me in the lawyer community so as to render me socially and professionally isolated by wrongly presenting me as some kind of failure with mental health issues. Therefore, my activity on LI became the target of a vicious troll campaign against me intended to discredit, embarrass and humiliate me. You did censor all of the most vicious targeting and I appreciate that. But as you must have noted I have been subjected to more than my fair share of hostility on LI and this is certainly part of a planned campaign against me.
On my part, I have not used LI to lobby for my complaints against GE or others involved.
I also agree that we agreed that you would moderate any comments of mine which violated LI policy.
Now coming to the two instances which have caused concern either to you or to me.
There is a third instance which I might as well mention.
On 14 July 2015, someone posted the following on a thread on LI http://www.legallyindia.com/Bar-Bench-Litigation/sibal-admits-literally-impossible-for-sahara-to-pay-rs-36-000-cr-in-18-months
“Ms Sapra,
I have stopped deluding myself that the "law" exists in the sense we read when studying law.. or are told by our well-wishers (family, friends, teachers etc).
And i no longer think it is reasonable to expect that the world must operate like the teachings of a principled texbook. In fact Nowhere on the planet is it so. One may preach principles. But please not try to expect principled behavior from those who believe not.
Power flows from wherever it does. To grudge that and to expect things to be 'right', is... well, childish.
India is a remarkable story. Numbingly lopsided, ill-managed, unfair and brutal.
And yet, attractive to a large segment of the world's rich folks. Because in all this "jungle-raaj", there are tremendous arbitrage opportunities and to be rich and create a buffer of obscene wealth is a sure way to cordon oneself off most if not all externalities. All ok by me at one level.
What I do get worried about, is how/what can parents teach in terms of universal values to their children? What will make the world better? Are we even trusting ourselves with the responsibility of being 'higher' beings? Or has 'humanity' already thrown in the towel??”
My response to that comment is also reproduced below.
“
Mr Iyer,
You've made a very incisive comment and one I agree with to a great extent, especially where I think you might have satire and sarcasm mixed with the truth about what it means to survive in India.
Sure, the law is bent and broken all over the world, but India and its higher judiciary stand in a class of their own, and the latter is all the more galling given the hypocritical paeans that are sung to our judiciary. Its a brutal hell-hole for those who become "prey" in this jungle-raj.
I realize how entrenched this power based distortion of Indian society is, but being a lawyer, I can't help noting and speaking about injustice and corruption of the rule of law by the courts.
Until precisely five years ago, I would have shared your nonchalance to an extent, but I have become caught up in a situation where I became the target of powerful people and entities for what I knew. I turned to the "law" for protection and faced its indifference to me, my rights and my very existence at a very personal level.
I guess when you become an unwitting victim of this jungle-raj, you can't remain indifferent to its brutality and hypocrisy anymore.
I have frankly lost all respect for our higher judiciary and for our Bar as an institution and for more lawyer 'colleagues' than I care to count.
Well 'life happens' and the fight must go on.
We must all eventually answer to our own conscience.”
You will note that I avoided any reference to GE or to my blog.
On 19 July 2015, someone anonymously posted a nasty comment against me on an LI thread at http://www.legallyindia.com/Bar-Bench-Litigation/want-your-arguments-in-court-video-recorded-here-s-the-order-that-might-help#comments
This comment which I think you should have censored or at least consulted me on, stated:
“By the way, is it true that you live inside the Delhi High Court building? I wish that your troubles end soon and you be able to live a fully functional life. It's nice to catch up with you on this forum - you are truly a pleasant person after a while.”
Please note that while this comment masquerades as a positive sentiment expressed in my favour, anyone reading it would take the comment to indicate that I was a failed lawyer and a homeless vagabond probably with mental health issues.
I am homeless since May 2012, but there are reasons for that, which take us back to my whistle-blower complaints and to my being deliberately targeted.
Since this comment was already online, I responded as below:
“No, Practical Lawyer, I don't live inside the Delhi High Court building, though I have been deliberately rendered homeless as part of being targeted for my corruption complaints against General Electric Company. Read my blog atseemasapra.blogspot.in/p/my-curriculum-vitae-until-before-i.html andseemasapra.blogspot.in/p/updated-court-documents-in-whistle.html'
I was forced to sleep in my car for over a year. On occasion I parked it outside gate 8 of the Delhi High Court. I was poisoned, drugged, my ankle deliberately dislocated, etc. I continue to be poisoned.
BTW, where did you get this info about me?”
Note that my blunt response silenced this person and other potential trolls on this thread. Several persons followed this link to my blog and not only read my CV but also looked at the court record in my writ petition against GE.
You will appreciate that I had no choice but to respond with the truth here. I did not agitate my complaints against GE, but defensively responded to deliberate targeting.
Then the incidents of yesterday happened. Again initially I only stated that I was the victim of crime because of whistleblowing. I did not mention GE.
It is only when someone anonymously belittled my statement that I had suffered as a crime victim, that I responded by elaborately on exactly how I had been targeted. I still did not mention GE.
I was validly comparing my experience as a victim of crime to those who suffered in the Mumbai bomb blasts. I think my ordeal stretched over 5 years and still continuing is far greater than those of individual victims of bomb blasts who might have died, suffered disability, homelessness, or destroyed futures. I have suffered all this and more except that I have survived several attempts to murder me and am the victim of ongoing chronic poisoning.
At the very least Kian, I was entitled to make the following statement on LI in my defence if I faced targeting there: I am a lawyer who has made whistleblower corruption complaints against GE and have been targeted by being drugged, rendered homeless, being poisoned, deliberate destruction of my ankle, being defamed. etc. I should be allowed to ask those making vicious comments about me whether and why they are deliberately targeting a whistleblower, and to direct them to my blog if they want to read the court record and my cv.
This does not mean that I would have converted LI into my blog or that I am using LI against GE. I would merely be putting trolls on notice about what they are doing. My being able to state this would mean that no one would dare to deliberately and with malafide intent troll me on LI as a target.
If GE or their lawyers like Zia Mody do not want me to post links to my blog on LI, they should stop my being deliberately targeted there.
But your response was to censor me instead when I was only defending myself.
Coming to people deliberately targeting me with vicious posts on LI, they are committing a criminal offence of targeting a whistleblower and they should be made aware of that.
I still don’t agree with the manner in which you censored my comments yesterday.
Seema Sapra
On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 11:50 AM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com> wrote:
Seema, I've explained why more than once: your comment had already caused people to start bringing up the GE case, responding with linking to your old blog posts, third-party blog posts questioning your mental health, etc. I did not publish any of these, because those comments violate our community guidelines and would have degenerated into you having a one-on-one battle with those commenters / trolls to prove them wrong, just as you're engaging with me now on email.
You promised me that you would not go down that rabbit hole not happen LI when you got the account. I've just looked up the old email of 28 June, in which you said:
"Sure Kian, I intend to remain polite, etc. I am not on LI to pick and fight battles and I realize that I cannot post about the GE stuff here. For that I have my blog."
This was in response to my email warning you:
By the way, for the avoidance of doubt, please use your LI account sensibly and be polite to others as you have been so far, and don't use it for GE etc stuff since LI is not the right forum for it :)
I generally won't moderate your comments but if something is inappropriate or defamatory etc, our usual moderation policy applies and I might step in to stop debate from getting too nasty as can happen online...
This type of moderation, which you agreed to, is exactly what I exercised yesterday (and not for the first time on LI), so please don't act surprised.
When you start comparing the murder of 100s in a terrorist attack to your experience, you invite people to debate your personal life and are pushing trolls' buttons which will not end well, hence at my prerogative I removed your comment and any others that would open that avenue.
A small part of my job in the comments section is trying to keep the debate civil and stop people from personally getting attacked and attacking others. Sometimes I step in too late since this is only a small part of my job amongst many others - in this case, we should have probably taken stricter action sooner to stop the trolls from provoking you to bring your personal life into it.
I trusted you with the privilege of an account that would allow you free publication and you told me you would abide by the rules of the site and not use it as a platform to wage personal battles.
If now you are making accusations against me, so be it, I can't stop you and feel free to, but you should know that you're alienating a neutral bystander who was sympathetic to your situation.
Best regards,
Kian
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 01/08/2015 11:13, Seema Sapra wrote:
Kian,
To record what happened yesterday on a Legally India Thread titled ‘Man died, justice lived’: How a group of lawyers opened the SC’s doors in the dead of night but failed by dawn [READ YAKUB WRIT & MERCY PETITIONS] at http://www.legallyindia.com/SCOI-Reports/man-died-justice-lived-yakub-memon#comment-74492
You permitted someone to anonymously post the following addressed to me.
"@ seema sapra - your view will change the day your closed one's suffer as result of these bombings".
In response I posted the following which was published
"I have suffered worse and continue to suffer for whistle-blowing and for standing up for my ethics. I am a victim of crime.
So don't preach to me about crime and punishment."
You then permitted someone to anonymously say the following in a long comment addressed to me
"(e) You say "I have suffered worse and continue to suffer for whistle-blowing and for standing up for my ethics. I am a victim of crime."- do u have absolutely no sense?!? You are equating whistle-blowing, standing up for ethics with cold-blooded murder of 300 people and more than 700 injured/ disabled. Do you realise how many were rendered homeless or had their future destroyed?"
Note that this comment above from a practicing Delhi lawyer very likely aware of my whistleblower complaints against General Electric Company mocked me for my statement that I was a victim of crime. He talks about the murder, disabilities, homelessness and lives destroyed in the 1993 bomb blasts but mocks me when attempts have been made on my life for 5 years, I have been drugged and poisoned, disabled by deliberate destruction of my ankle, rendered homeless so that for over one year I slept in my car both at the height of the Delhi winter and the Delhi summer and the destruction of my life, my career, my future, and the deliberate destruction of my reputation.
So I responded to that in a comment where I also stated the following which was published.
"As far as I am concerned, attempts are being made to eliminate me since 2010. Attempts to murder me. I have been drugged, poisoned, ankle dislocated, rendered homeless, defamed, and I could go on. So don't minimize my ordeal which has stretched to 5 years.
Read my blog if you care to."
Within minutes, you censored the above part of my comment. Why?
When I protested to you on email, you refused to publish this part. Why? This is the truth about how I have been criminally targeted but you don't want to publish it.
If you had published it, people would have been forced to stop targeting me anonymously on LI.
I posted two more comments merely stating that you were not allowing me to respond to the comment mocking me. You also censored those two comments of mine.
You then on my request also censored the following
"(e) You say "I have suffered worse and continue to suffer for whistle-blowing and for standing up for my ethics. I am a victim of crime."- do u have absolutely no sense?!? You are equating whistle-blowing, standing up for ethics with cold-blooded murder of 300 people and more than 700 injured/ disabled. Do you realise how many were rendered homeless or had their future destroyed?"
Then for reasons of your own you proceeded to censor the following comment of mine as well
"I have suffered worse and continue to suffer for whistle-blowing and for standing up for my ethics. I am a victim of crime.
So don't preach to me about crime and punishment".
You then posted a comment on the thread you would not be permitting further posts as the thread had degenerated int name-calling. This was misleading as essentially you wanted to prevent me from making any reference to my being targeted for whistleblowing including to attempts to murder me even though you permitted a lawyer to anonymously mock me.
This morning you have modified your comment on the thread to read as under
"Guys, this thread has degenerated into too much bilateral back-and-forth that adds very little to the debate or the story.
We won't be publishing any further comments on this thread for a while unless they make legitimate legal arguments and do not contain personal attacks or counter-attacks or allegations.
Thanks
Kian"
I am sorry Kian, but it appears that you are aligned with Zia Mody et al to cover up the fact that I am being targeted for whistle-blowing. Zia Mody was the lawyer for Genneral Electric Company on the matter of my whistleblower complaints.
There is no other explanation for your actions. You have violated journalistic ethics.
I will ask that you post this email from me on Legally India. You can have no objection to that.
I do not intend to continue commenting on LI because of your unethical censorship of my defensive comments while permitting people to anonymously target me.
Please post this on LI.
Seema Sapra
On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 8:00 AM, Seema Sapra <seema.sapra@googlemail.com>wrote:
Kian,
Sorry that got sent out before I could complete. Here's the full response.
I disagree with your response. Yesterday someone spoke directly to me as a person, you allowed that. I responded mentioning I had experienced being a victim of crime myself. Then someone who was most likely aware of my background belittled me. You allowed that. But when I responded you shut me down.
And then you censored the entire conversation including my statement that I had experience being a victim of crime. You censored my comments without consulting me and then you posted a misleading statement that you were stopping comments because of name-calling.
I am perfectly capable of defending myself from trolls and I don't agree that in doing so I would have made LI an extension of my blog.
But censoring my comments in the manner you did yesterday remains unacceptable to me.
I am at least entitled to tell people that I am a whistle-blower and to call out people if they are attacking me online for that.
Further, there was nothing wrong in my asking the commenter Yo Yo if he belonged to Rohatgi's chamber.
And how did you allow a comment targeting me by asking me if I lived inside the Delhi High Court premises. That was the first time I had referenced my whistleblower complaint against GE in response. My whole writ petition against GE which went on for 3 years was not "news" for you.
I will not be commenting on LI based upon your position. You want to censor me from telling people that I have been targeted for whistleblowing. That I have been drugged, poisoned, had an ankle dislocated, defamed, rendered homeless, life destroyed etc as part of that targeting. And that my life remains in danger. This is who I am now and you will not allow me to mention this even to defend myself against attacks.
The fact is that the minute I mention this, no one will dare attack me publicly so there would be no trolling.
And as stated if I am targeted on Legally India in the future, I will take steps available to me.
I again state that your concern seems more to protect General Electric Company, AZB, Zia Mody, etc from embarrassment than controlling trolling.
Seema Sapra
On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Seema Sapra <seema.sapra@googlemail.com>wrote:
Kian,
I disagree with your response. Yesterday someone spoke directly to me as a person, you allowed that. I responded mentioning I had experienced being a victim of crime myself. Then someone who was most likely aware of my background belittled me. You allowed that. But when I responded you shut me down.
And then you censored the entire conversation including my statement that I had experience being a victim of crime. You censored y comments without consulting me and then you posted a misleading statement that you were stopping comments because of name-calling.
I am perfectly capable of defending myself from trolls and I don't agree that in doing so I would have made LI an extension of my blog.
But censoring my comments in the manner you did yesterday remains unacceptable to me.
I am at least entitled to tell people that I am a whistle-blower and to call out people if they are attacking me online for that.
Further, there was nothing wrong in my asking the commenter Yo Yo if he belonged to Rohatgi's chamber.
And how did you allow a comment targeting me by asking me if I lived inside the Delhi High Court premises. That was the first time I had referenced my whistleblower compaint against GE in response. My whole writ petition against GE which went on for 3 years was not "news" for you.
I will not be commenting on LI.
And as stated if I am targeted there, I will take steps available to me.
I again state that
On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:05 PM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com> wrote:
Hi Seema,
I am sorry to hear that and that you were hurt, and it's your prerogative not to comment anymore.
However, I am responsible for keeping some sort of peace in the commenting section and to stop it from degenerating into personal attacks, while trying to maintain it as a safe space of relevant discussion, which I have to exercise on a daily basis in discussions that exclude you too.
Your comments, particularly when you began to raise your background, opened yourself up to personal attacks which several commenters then seized on to start bringing the entire GE, etc story into it. This you could only have responded to increasingly by going into the whole GE story to defend yourself (as was beginning to happen in your comments which I then started moderating).
Trolls would have endlessly continued responding to your defences behind a veil of anonymity and it would have opened up the entire can of worms and it would have essentially turned the comment section into an extension of your personal blog and grievances, which does not add to the quality of the discussion on LI.
Since you are commenting in your own name, I have carefully tried to moderate any personal attacks on you to date as far as possible, other than people disagreeing with you on substance (even if I personally disagree with their argument or retrogate mindset). This is the same policy we apply to others commenting under their own name too. Sometimes comments that are provocative slip through though and that's something we don't have the bandwidth to police continuously.
Furthermore, such engagements basically degenerate into trolling, with people clearly posting comments to get a response from you because they're bored or insensitive, which creates an unpleasant atmosphere in the commenting section for everyone.
I have a lot of experience in dealing with trolls on the site and know how they think and work to a large extent, and I stand by my decision to step in in this case because it wouldn't have ended well nor given anyone any pleasure or resolution.
Best regards,
Kian
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 31/07/2015 20:50, Seema Sapra wrote:
Kian,
I have decided that I will not be commenting on Legally India again.
I am not happy with your arbitrary censoring of my comments today.
First I did not attack anyone.
Because of my background, I am a target for people on LI, people who are deliberately incited to troll and target me.
I could easily deal with such targeting and defend myself and such trolling would stop but you are putting unjustifiable restrictions on me as to what I can or cannot share about my background and my whistle-blower complaints.
The fact that I have been targeted because of my complaints against General Electric and some lawyers is something that I should not be prohibited from sharing.
In fact LI acts so often as a forum for people who have been victimized or for people to vent their genuine grievances. But in my case you will not allow me to even defend myself against attack.
In the beginning when I responded to attacks you did not publish those responses by offering instead to delete the comments attacking me.
Once I registered on the site, there have been several instances of published attacks targeting me but you have constrained my ability to respond and defend myself. Today especially I did not appreciate what you did. I was very offended as well as hurt.
You will not even allow me to communicate my circumstances and how I am being targeted. Yet you recently published a comment where someone maliciously asked me if I lived inside the Delhi High Court building. I frankly think your attitude devalues me as a human being.
My comment today that I was a victim of crime myself in response to a comment saying I should first "suffer" violence was a valid comment.
Then the response belittled the violence directed at me and when I responded you censored that.
You have by your actions today also made it publicly known to your constituency of readers that I am not allowed to comment freely on your website unlike others.
You keep using protecting me from trolling as an excuse but it looks as if you really want to avoid embarrassing GE, AZB etc.
I could understand if you did not want me to use LI to agitate my whistle-blower and threat to life complaints but you won't even permit me to describe myself as a whistle-blower or to speak about my life circumstances, even as defence against attempts to publicly humiliate me.
I expect persons who wanted me off LI or wanted to publicly humiliate me there will be happy.
I'll keep the registration active just so that no one impersonate me.
If I am targeted on LI in the future I will take steps available to me.
Seema
On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 5:57 PM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com> wrote:
Yes, but every defence provokes another attack, provokes another defence ad infinitum, at which point we have intervened in the past also on similar stories.
Will edit the name calling bit...
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 31/07/2015 17:55, Seema Sapra wrote:
Now you have edited the statement I found offensive.
RE your last comment
"Guys, this thread has degenerated into too much bilateral name calling.
We won't be publishing any further comments on this thread for a while unless they make legitimate legal arguments and do not contain personal attacks or counter-attacks or allegations.
Thanks
Kian"
the only name calling going on for the last 3-4 days was targeting me.
I only responded defensively today.
Anyway this whole thing makes me very unhappy.
Seema
On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 5:48 PM, KIAN GANZ (Legally India) <kian.ganz@legallyindia.com>wrote:
Seema, if you ask me to delete that comment you can't then re-post it. :)
--
Kian Ganz
Publishing Editor
Legally India - News for Lawyers
http://www.LegallyIndia.com
kian.ganz@LegallyIndia.com
Tel (India): +91 900 405 6651
Twitter: http://twitter.com/legallyindia
On 31/07/2015 17:46, Legally India wrote:
Comment on: :‘Man died, justice lived’: How a group of lawyers opened the SC’s doors in the dead of night but failed by dawn [READ YAKUB WRIT & MERCY PETITIONS]
# Seema Sapra(seema.sapra@gmail.com,IP: 122.176.8.122) —2015-07-31 17:46
I am deeply offended by this statement:
"(e) You say "I have suffered worse and continue to suffer for whistle-blowing and for standing up for my ethics. I am a victim of crime."- do u have absolutely no sense?!? You are equating whistle-blowing, standing up for ethics with cold-blooded murder of 300 people and more than 700 injured/ disabled. Do you realise how many were rendered homeless or had their future destroyed?"
Kian, you censored my response to this which merely described what I have gone through for 5 years and am still going through.
I find this extremely unfair.
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